Museums

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ChrisThies
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Museums

Postby ChrisThies » Mon Aug 30, 2004 7:45 pm

Has anyone had the opportunity to visit the 'Royal Armouries, USA' exhibit at the Owsley Brown Frazier Historical Arms Museum in Louisville KY?
http://www.frazierarmsmuseum.org/royal_armouries_usa.html
At the beginning of this year they received 8 1/2 tons (just under 400 artifacts) from the Royal Armouries for display on the top floor of their 3 story museum. I am curious how this display compares to the some of the other arms & armour displays available for viewing here in the States (such as the Harding Collection of Arms & Armor at the Art Institute of Chicago, which has a permanent gallery exhibit of 225 objects drawn from a 1500+ collection).
I also see listed in their [Frazier Historical Arms Museum's] impressive living histories exhibits that they also have a hand and a half sword display ['based upon
German and Italian sources'] pending, its status is currently "in rehersal".
Any reviews on this or other Stateside museum displays that would warrant a side trip for any traveling ARMA scholars?
{Good fencers make good neighbors}
Christopher Thies

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Patrick Hardin
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Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2002 5:25 pm
Location: Memphis, TN

Re: Museums

Postby Patrick Hardin » Fri Sep 03, 2004 1:26 pm

I plan to run up there and check the museum out next week sometime. I'll be glad to post my humble impressions of it here when I get back.

Patrick Hardin
"Few men are born brave. Many become so through training and force of discipline."

---Vegetius

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David Kite
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Joined: Fri Sep 20, 2002 10:34 am
Location: Terre Haute, IN USA

Re: Museums

Postby David Kite » Fri Sep 03, 2004 5:16 pm

Awesome! Yes, please do report! Let us know how many swords they've got. When I browsed the site, they didn't have too many listed. I plan on making a trip down there at some point as well, I just don't know when I'll be able to do it.

David Kite

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DavidEvans
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Joined: Mon Apr 28, 2003 8:30 am
Location: Wiltshire, UK

Re: Museums

Postby DavidEvans » Mon Sep 06, 2004 2:43 am

Doesn't surprise me. The whole reason for building the Royal armouries in Leeds was to find somewhere to display the tons of kit hidden in the Tower of London. They've still got stuff hidden way that they can't display so leting it go on tour makes sense.!

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Patrick Hardin
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Location: Memphis, TN

Re: Museums

Postby Patrick Hardin » Wed Sep 29, 2004 1:12 pm

Okay, I've been to Louisville and back. The Frazier Arms Museum is not a particularly huge museum. I would call it about medium sized. You can see everything in it in an afternoon. The general theme of the museum is to trace the development of arms and armor from the Middle Ages through the nineteenth century, starting with England, moving through the colonization of America, India and Africa and then into arms in the United States. The Medieval/Renaissance/Colonial Period stuff is all on the third floor. As for the number of items, I would say there are around 150 or so weapons on display on the third floor, give or take. This includes swords, daggers and polearms. There is a similar number of early firearms on the third floor as well, and there is also a fair amount of armor. The second floor is exclusively firearms used in the US, during the Revolution, Civil War, settling of the American West, etc. The first floor houses the premier pieces of the Frazier collection. There are a lot of VERY fancy guns there.

Now, some highlights of the third floor. There are a number of life-size displays there of soldiers in combat. There is one of the battle of Hastings, one of Agincourt, one showing colonial troops fighting Native Americans, one of British troops fighting Zulus, you get the idea. The dummys are equipped mostly with replica weapons/armor/clothing. I think I recognized some MRL stuff. There are a number of booths near the displays where you can sit down and watch short video clips describing certain aspects of war. There was one on battlefield tactics, one on archery, one on mail, one on plate armor, etc. Most of these were from the Arms in Action series.

I found several of the original items on display very fascinating. They had a full mail hauberk on display. The interesting thing about it was that the rings on the sleeves were much thinner than the rings on the torso. More protection for the vitals, I guess. They also had a few medieval daggers with what were apparently their original hilts. One, a ballock dagger I think, was single edged, but unbelievably thick at the spine. I think it was half an inch thick where the blade met the hilt. Who ever said medieval daggers were meant for slashing? <img src="/forum/images/icons/grin.gif" alt="" /> If there was ever a dagger designed to punch through mail, this was it. There was one longsword on display. The blade was absolutely beautiful, in perfect condition, but the hilt was modern. They had it labeled as a two handed sword, but it was most definitely a hand-and-a-half sword. That was one mistake I noticed. There was also a display of men in late 17th century armor fighting on horseback with rapiers! Go figure.

I also noticed a cut-and-thrust sword with a deep nick in the blade. But the nick was square, not wedge shaped. It could not have come from the edge of another blade, unless somebody blocked with the ricasso. More likely I would think, it came from the edge of a buckler, or the edge of someone's helmet. There were several smallswords in the collection. A lot of them were extremely thick at the hilt, much thicker than you would imagine a smallsword blade being, though they quickly tapered to a very fine point. One was actually wide and thick for nearly half the blade, before suddenly tapering off to a slender point for the last half. I never knew any smallswords were ever made like that, though it does make sense in terms of balance.

Also, if you've ever read Hank Reinhardt's essay, There is no Best Sword, and read him describing the Abyssinian sword called a shotel, they have one on display in the colonial section.

But my absolute favorite thing on display in the entire museum has to be a mail bishop's mantle from the Renaissance. The rings were so fine that, at first, I thought the thing was made out of cloth. John, it was finer than that patch of mail you carry with you to events. Seriously, I think the rings were about the size of this upper-case O. Maybe 1/8" in diameter. That is absolutely tiny. To quote the Numidian from the movie Gladiator: "I didn't know men could build such things." Truly an impressive testament to the skill and craftsmanship of our ancestors.

In the center of the third floor is the tournament gallery. There they have a fenced-off area just like the one at the Royal Armouries at Leeds. And inside, they have fight interpreters who put on live demonstrations for the public. If you've ever seen the Arms in Action video on the sword, there's a part where guys from the RA act out scenes from Romeo and Juliet. It's pretty much exactly like that. They also mention George Silver and Saviolo in their demonstrations. I liked the sword and buckler stuff pretty well, but IMO there was way too much slashing when they brought the rapiers out. When I talked to one of the interpreters about it, he used that old argument about how some rapiers had the upper portions of their blades sharpened. He was from a stage-fighting background, so I guess he didn't know any better. He had also never heard of ARMA. I asked about other weapons and he said that their other shows were still in rehearsal. He said they should have one ready on two-handed swords (which is what they call hand-and-a-half swords, I guess) in about two months, and one on armored fighting in six months or so.

Well, those are my "humble" impressions of the Frazier Historical Arms museum. I would sum it all up by saying it's definitely worth the trip. I had a good time.

Patrick Hardin
"Few men are born brave. Many become so through training and force of discipline."



---Vegetius

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Aaron Pynenberg
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Location: Appleton WI

Re: Museums

Postby Aaron Pynenberg » Wed Sep 29, 2004 3:11 pm

Chris, Pat

Hello, quick report on the Oshkosh Public Museum's Oakeshott exhibit. They had a portion of his collection on display for a few weeks here in Wisconsin,(of all places!)

The Oshkosh Public Museum is very small, but has some very interesting exhibits, much of it is based on Tribal artefacts and Colonial Wisconsin, but the Third floor had the exhibit. The first thing you saw when walking in was a huge, replica tapestry of a scene from the Majowski Bible(sp?) It showed two knights in tournament, with arming swords and kite shield, great helms and mail, one was splitting the others skull with an oberhau, through the great helm. There were three maidens watching from above, one clearly upset and then one looking rather joyous.

Then there were a pair of Gothic Gauntlets, compared with some replica ones. They were truely amazing in the amount of fine detail and beautiful sweeping lines, they were very impressive, I would have loved to see the full harness, that would truely be a sight!

Most of the rest of the exhibit was made up of replica weapons from Arms and Armour, but there were about 8 period arms to check out. There were about 4 hand and a halfs, which were just awesome. Most were XVa's with a few XVIa's. The coolest part though was some of the damage that these blades displayed. There were many which had square shaped nicks along the Strong of the blade, above the ricassio, there was also one which had evidence of reshaping, and resharpening, the edge had been re-done, probably to repair damage. There was another which had personlized etching done along the blade, of a row of collums, a sun shaped feature and another symbol which was unknown.

There was another which claimed to have the original leather still on the grip! Needless to say it was all very cool. The rest of the display had some axe-heads and other farming implements mixed in with more replicas.

The two-handed replicas were also very stunning. I had never seen the actual size and length of some of these babies, wow some were 5-6 ft in length, and still weighing in at about 6.0 6.5 lbs. Incredible- Well time for work see you- train hard- Aaron
"Because I Like It"


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