Ringeks unarmed.

[Joachim Nilsson]

Yeah, excellent idea. I want to actively incorporate more unarmed techniques in both our regular training as well as in the seminars. Both Ringneck as well as Wallerstein. I think a good understanding and proficiency in unarmed techniques and combat really helps to further one's own ability in say longswordning for example.

And don't worry -I will bring Wallerstein with me.

Thanx for complimenting me on my Talhoffer tattoo. <img src="/forum/images/icons/grin.gif" alt="" />

[Alex Hughes]

"The translation on this web site is one of the early translations, thus some of it is supect, but over all I think it is OK."

The translation is indeed far from perfect. While I was happy for Arma to put it up it has always needed more work which I simply have not had the time or since the widespread availability of CHTobler's translation, the inclination to do. If you really want to study Ringeck you need to get this book.

"And there seems to be a misunderstanding in the translation when it says "Leg-breaks". The following techniques are aimed at the elbows and arms."

This is a somewhat difficult translation. It doesn't seem to refer to breaking the bones of the leg so much as breaking the contact between the ground and the legs.

Alex.

[Richard Strey]

My knowledge of the old German is almost nonexistant, mind you. However, the original wording was "Bein-Bruch", right? And in the past, "Bein" also had the meaning "Bone".
This would make the techniques "Bone-Breakers". Just a thought.

[Joachim Nilsson]

Yes, I agree on the "bone-breaker" translation of beinbruch. We have a similar word in Swedish called benbrott which literary means "bonebreak/broken bone". (Germany have had a very big cultural influence and exchange with Sweden in medieval and renaissance times.) And a lot of the techniques would result in just that -broken bones- if performed and executed properly. Which is nice. Me like bonebreak. <img src="/forum/images/icons/grin.gif" alt="" />

Regards,

[philippewillaume]

hello
I think beinbruch has two signifaction
here the text on bain bruch from the manual.
the first part is really throws where you collapse the leg

Von bain brüchen: der erst bain bruch.
About the leg breaks: The first leg break

Das ist das gemain ringen an armen, daß do haist: ain bain bruch; das trybmitt kröfften. Vnd begryffest du im den gerechten arm, (74 v ) so tritt in mittdem rechten fuß hindersich vnd versetz im mitt dem lincken fuß für sin bain;vnd stoß in für sich über die huff: damit volg.
This is the common (gemain= gemein) wrestling at the arms, which you heard. A leg break that you execute with craft (krofften=kraeften). And grab him in the appropriate or right arm. So you walk with the right foot behind him and displace him with the left foot for/at his leg and throw/chop/strike him away (fur sich=apart) over/across the (huff=hufte)hips with that follows (up)
==>hip throw Like tenchi nage but with less arm and more hips IE tench nage with koshinage in it.


Ain ander bainbruch.
The second leg break

Mitt welcher hand ain man dich an grifft, der hand nym war; vnd begryftden arm mitt bayden henden hinder siner hand, vnd wend vmb din ruck fürsein bauch. An dem vmbwenden, so heb sin arm vff din nächste achsel vnddruck do mitt nider: so brichst du im do mitt den arm. Ob dir der bruchvolgt, wend dich vmb vnd ring.

With what ever hand he tries to grab you with, you grab that hand with both/either hands/grips behind his hand, and turn you back at his belly, at the turn so hold his arm on your closest shoulder and press it down, so breaking the arm. If he follows the break, turn yourself around and wrestle.

==>Shihonage in front both are facing the same direction. I.e. arm over the shoulder

(75 r )Der dritt bain bruch.
The third leg break
Wie dir ainer die hand zaygt vnd will dich gryffen mitt schlengenn odermitt stossen oder mitt ringen: der hand nym war; vnd begryff sy von vndenvff mitt der lincken hand. Vnd gryff mitt der rechten hand durch sin vchsenan dem selben arm by der lincken hand. Zu lauff, vnd versetz din rechtenfuß hinder sin rechts bain, vnd truck in hindersich über die lende. Do mittthu ain griff, vnd halt in föst.

If one shown that he will attack you with the hand and will try to grab, strike or wrestle. This hand you will catch, and grab it from under and out with the left hand. And grab with the right hand through armpit at the same arm by the left hand. Step in and displace/move your right foot under his right leg and press in behind him across the loin, with that do a grab and hold him fast.

==> shihonage ura wasa ish. You grab the hand from the inside out with a grip with the thumb bellow (that will rotate his arm and you can grab from under the shoulder with right hand.
PS the difference with the ringen shihonage and this one is that ringen=projection and bruch=break if it is shihonague it is the normal one.


Der vierd bainbruch. (75 v )
The fourth leg break
Mit wölcher hand dich ainer angrifft, der selben hand nym war; vnd begryff im die hand, alß du tust in dem andern bain brüchen, vnd wisch immitt dem haupt vnd lyb durch den selben arm, vnd truck im dann syn armhart. Vnd ruck im denn sin nechsten fuß, so fölt er.

Whatever (with which) hand he attacks you, you grab with the same hand and hold as you did in the second leg break, and clean/wipe him with the head and fall/go through the same arm, and press him then hard at the arm and turn him/turn at him then on his nearest foot, so he is chopped down

==> Classical shihonage irimi omote


just after that you have (which are actually breaking the leg)
In dem bain sind zwen brich:
There is two breaks at the leg

Der erst.
Begryff im sin bain mitt baiden henden an, mitt der ainen hand ober demenckel, mitt der andern an das kny. Das gät dar, alß der erst bainbruch.
Grab him at the leg with both/either gips/hands, with one hand over the ankle and the other upon the knee. It goes there as the first break at the leg.

==>Self-explanatory

(76 r )Der ander bruch.
The second break
Begreyff jm ain bain ober dem anckel mitt baiden henden, vnd ruck imdas über die achsel, so brüchst du im das bain.
Grab him with either/both hands/grip at the leg above the ankle, And turn/move it over the shoulder/armpit so you break his leg
==>Self-explanatory


ps sorry for the aikido reference but those are comming from my personal notes (and it kinds of help me)

Pss ringeck has a nice wrestling however it is a real pain to translate. it think it is comming for an older text than the sword (or they did not need that mauch explaining..)