Mittelhau mechanics?

[Jeffrey Hull]

Hey Guys:

Okay, along with Jake's further explanation and the Mair instructions, I would now agree that the Mittelhau should be high to head yet is distinct from Zwerchhau.

I would still insist that one can make the *Bauchhau* (*belly-hew*, just to give it some name) and make it strongly, as my recent practice thereof has shown me it is possible, and worth training. A lot of it involves not just levering but a small yet significant shift of grip, which may or may not be in any manual showing Nebenhut (still researching that). I just wish I could show you guys what I have learned in this regard by physical demonstration (difficult to do over Web).

You all are still free to disagree with me there. <img src="/forum/images/icons/wink.gif" alt="" />

Nonetheless, I thank you all for the lessons compiled here to help figure out what the deal is with Mittlehau.

JH

[Brian Hunt]

One of the other interesting things about this plate, is that it answers the original question of what is the best starting position for a mittlehaw. It shows us both the left and the right sides position for throwing on, plus it tells us at what height we should be doing it.

I love Mair's manuals. I will have to see if I can extract out his other instructions on the mittlehaw from the text only section of his manual on longsword. That should be the plate that was referenced on 30v.

Brian Hunt

[Shane Smith]

Good stuff Brian. That indeed appears to be what we in VAB refer to as the mittlehau and it is what I was attempting to relate earlier. Thanks! <img src="/forum/images/icons/cool.gif" alt="" />

[Jared L. Cass]

Yep. David's bellyhaws "killed me" by cutting under his buckler. And almost exclusivly when we were both on the pass with eachother. They were definently bellyhaws and not unterhaws because his blade edge typically cought me straight across the belly...not a belly to armpit cut.

Working through the typical/basic 8 cut drill today and making the mittlehau high across the head/neck region really felt smooth as butter in comparison to the old way of throwing it to the mid section. <img src="/forum/images/icons/smile.gif" alt="" />

Jared L. Cass, ARMA Associate, Wisconsin

[Jake_Norwood]

Jared-

I suspected that that was the case. The presence of that extra weapon (the buckler) changes a lot of stuff. I recall that in Stew and Brian's demonstration at the Provo event last month that you usually cut around the buckler in any given direction, whether over, under, etc. I'll bet we could find a belly hau there, somewhere. Cool.

Jake

[Jake_Norwood]

Actually, IIRC, Meyer has a position (not in his 12 stances, but it shows up later, and it's in the dagger section) called "Mittelhut." And it looks just like those images. It's in the staff section, too.

Jake

[Brian Hunt]

Cool,

I will have to take a look for that in Meyer, could be interesting.

As for sword and buckler, I would be more inclined to thrust someone in the belly while defending my head with my buckler, that try and cut them across the belly, more reach and is much more deadly, especially if I twist and rip my blade back out in a sideways/up/down direction. But, I would only do the thrust after I had bound my opponent up in some manner with the buckler, so he was only left with defense, and no offensive moves (vor and nach).

Brian Hunt.
GFS