Ton of questions re: arms, armor, combat

[Sal Bertucci]

So to some up what they said about the test here are some quotes:

Mr. Staberg states that that the "modern steels are better than old steels" statement is false do to the variability of the types of steel both then and now. (In and of itself a probably true statement)

Mr. Gemvik Goes on to state that GENERALLY modern steels are better than old steel due to reasons other then those made by Mr. Staberg.

Mr. Staberg then points out that the helm pictured is probably too thin to be accurate.

Mr. Gemvik admits that it does sound a bit on the thin side with a thickness of 1.27mm, but then goes on to say that he has seen metal 2mm thick (which is approximately 157% thicker and would logically fit into Mr. Staberg's ideas of a more correct thickness) be punctured by similar weapons. Which lends more credibility to our side of the discussion. Which is that warhammers, spears, poleaxes, etc. CAN and DID pierce plate mail with frequency enough to not be "poetic license".

There is also the plates that I dug up that show period arms piercing period armor, which should also not be set aside.

Good luck with your endeavors, and I hope your novel works out for you.

[Gene Tausk]

I personally am inclined to think that armour couldn't be pierced by a warhammer La Noue mentions even a couched lance couldn't get through.

And I said that sometimes knights dismounted, only sometimes usually they fought on horseback.

Yeah, there is no way that a warhammer can penetrate a helm. Yipper, no way. I saw the same demonstration that Stacy say, and can also testify as to the effectiveness.

War hammers were designed, in part, to penetrate plate armor in the never ending battle between offensive weapons and defensive armor. The fight books were written as comic books - they are technical manuals. I am more willing to believe a description of a technique accompanied by an illustration from a person who actually lived and died with these weapons.

Sir, I did nothing to elict your sarcasm. I have also posted my thoughts on the whole warhammer thing.

Just for my own curiosity could I see the aforementioned illustrations please?

Well, my homey Sal has my back, so feel free to inspect his links.

Here are some more for you:

http://www.myarmoury.com/feature_spot_poleaxe.html

As for your cries of "sarcasm," spare me. You already have somewhat of a reputation for posting nonsense (remember your thought out post about swimming in full armor with no evidence to back it up), and this appears to me to be more of the same.

Also, think about it. A solid weapon with a strong point used with two hands. What do you think would happen if it were used against plate? Will it *always* penetrate plate armor, or any armor for that matter? Of course not, for reasons already stated by Stacy. But to discount the entire writings of people who lived and died by these weapons is absurd at best.

Give me a break and back up what you say.

Here you are:

http://www.myarmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=19416 this discusses the whole test warhammer test thing.

However I will not be back for a variety of reasons (the computer monitor hurting my eyes figures prominently)

Great. So you admit you have no evidence to support your claim and you are asking others to do the research for you.

Have you thought about asking Al Gore for a job?

[Martin Lysen]

The researching writer would do well to read up on accounts of duels and private feuds from history, a great deal of which can be found via this site. For a more generalized look on the nature of battle for the individual soldier, be sure to read John Keegan's "The Face of Battle" and "The Mask of Command". They look in depth on what it could have been like to engage in warfare during both the pre and post gunpowder eras.

That much being said, I have done a lot of group combat, and cooperation and communication are the keys to victory, as well as being animated by the same sense of bravado as your friends are. Helmets notwithstanding, you can still shout out orders, warnings and encouragements that will be heard i a skirmish. Learning to cooperate effectively takes time and training. This is why bonds of friendship were so highly regarded, as well as courage and loyalty to your immediate group of peers. A well trained small group of fighters that has been working together and come to know each others way of fighting can cut an uncoordinated mob to absolute ribbons. They still have to talk to each other while doing it, but many manoeuvres, tactical tricks and principles can be learnt by a group and executed blindingly fast. Knowing how to support your friends and outflank the enemy makes all the difference in the world.

[Alex Johans]

What are the weapons of your country?