Making leather coat for sparring - need advice

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Alfred Wong
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Making leather coat for sparring - need advice

Postby Alfred Wong » Sun Apr 03, 2005 4:19 am

Dear all,

After considering the cost, weather* and material avaliable - I decided to make a leather coat with the following pattern:

http://www.armourarchive.org/patterns/wisby_cop/

While there's actually no exoerience for me, I would like to ask if anyone had tried building his own leather armour? And please - tell me some tips!

(Hardening is not necessary for the base, but maybe for the plate)

* Although I love plates - wearing it in a tropical monsoon weather is not wise. *

Best wishes,
Alfred
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JeffGentry
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Re: Making leather coat for sparring - need advice

Postby JeffGentry » Sun Apr 03, 2005 9:31 am

Hey Alfred

* Although I love plates - wearing it in a tropical monsoon weather is not wise. *



Why it will protect you from flying debris and the added weight will help keep you from getting blown away.

laughing

Jeff
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Brian Hunt
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Re: Making leather coat for sparring - need advice

Postby Brian Hunt » Sun Apr 03, 2005 1:38 pm

HI Alfred,

the leather is just the vehicle to rivet the plates to. You are correct that it doesn't need to be hardened. This is an easy type of armor to make. Make the plates out of 18 or 16 gage cold rolled steel (I have no idea if the gages are different in Hong Kong). Then layout your cardboard/posterboard pattern and mark it onto the steel with a black marker (I use a sharpie). Now you have to cut it out. The best way is with a beverly shear (a throatless hand operated set of bench mounted scissors for steel), alternatly you could use a power jigsaw with metal cutting blades, or if your hands are tough, a pair of hand shears (this will generally not do 16 but will work for 18). Using a rubber or rahide mallet bend the few plates that need to be curved over a piece of pipe that is held in a vise, tied down between 2 saw horses, etc. Mark and drill your rivet holes in the plates, or if your a lucky guy and have a steel punch, do that instead, or you could go old school and heat them in a forge and use a steel punch on your anvil to create the holes. Now it is time to cut and sew out your leather cover. Make yourself a paper pattern and adjust it to fit your body, when you are happy with this, then and only then cut your leather. If you want to save money, use a heavy canvas instead. For really inexpensive canvas, buy yourself a heavy painters drop cloth. Now lay your plates out on the inside of your canvas or leather cover and mark all the rivet points with a marker. Then using a hand punch for leather punch all the rivet points, if your using canvas, just use a sharp awl to push the holes through the canvas (this causes the least thread breakage for strength). Then rivet the plates to your cover (I like to use a washer on the outside of the canvas/leather cover to help support and spread out the pull of the rivet against the cover. Attach your straps and buckles.

Congradulations you now have your first piece of armor, now all you need is legs, arms, a helmet and gaunlets and you are set for armoured combat.

If you are just wanting something to protect you for padded/wooden weapon sparring, I would go with making a heavy gambeson/padded-jack instead. Cloth armour is a different ball of wax, than a coat of plates, and has it's own inherent challenges. At arador.com they have a forum discussion group dedicated to cloth armour, I would do some serious reading there if you decide to go with cloth armour instead.

hope this helps.

Brian Hunt
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Alfred Wong
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Re: Making leather coat for sparring - need advice

Postby Alfred Wong » Sun Apr 03, 2005 9:27 pm

Ha ha, Jeff

Well also the humidity and the friendly good ol' SUN. Imagine a knight in full plate at 90% humidity and 30 "C, clear sky with no cloud - LoL!

Dear Brian,

Thanks for the tips. It seems that the meatal work is quite impossible for me to do in my little flat, and I looked at my budget - well, I think I will probably replace the plates needed with leather, OR

Just draw the pattern and give it tio the meatal workshop to make them <img src="/forum/images/icons/smile.gif" alt="" />

So, to make the Wisby coat, I would only need to draw a pattern, make a cardboard sample to try out, then cut the leather, wait for the plates and rivet them on - seems that it will work out well. <img src="/forum/images/icons/smile.gif" alt="" />

Thanks for your kind respond!

Alfred <img src="/forum/images/icons/smile.gif" alt="" />
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Brian Hunt
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Re: Making leather coat for sparring - need advice

Postby Brian Hunt » Sun Apr 03, 2005 11:17 pm

Oh,

one more thing, since you have a high humidty index and you will need to worry about rust, it is perfectly period an appropriate to paint your plates black before you rivet them to the leather.

hope this helps.

Brian Hunt
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Alfred Wong
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Re: Making leather coat for sparring - need advice

Postby Alfred Wong » Mon Apr 04, 2005 3:18 am

Dear Brian,

Sure, but I think I will use stainless steel in this case then. Humidity is a true big problem, the rusting of sword is quite serious if we don't treat them probably after usage,

Best wishes,
Alfred <img src="/forum/images/icons/smile.gif" alt="" />
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Matthew_Anderson
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Re: Making leather coat for sparring - need advice

Postby Matthew_Anderson » Mon Apr 04, 2005 7:21 am

My coat of plates is made with galvanized steel plates from Home Depot. They are normally used for tying rafters to walls and so forth. They don't rust, can be cut with tin snips, and already have holes for the rivets. I used copper roofing nails for rivets. It only took me a few hours and came out pretty good for an amatuer:

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Alfred Wong
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Re: Making leather coat for sparring - need advice

Postby Alfred Wong » Mon Apr 04, 2005 7:56 am

Dear Matthew,

Galvanzied steel - perhaps a nice choice too but I think I will use stainless steel instead, as the znic coating is actually more reactive than iron, and it will possibly happens here...

I would like to know, Matthew, shall I have the metal plates facing in or out? Since I don't think there will be a gamebeson for me to wear under the armour, I don't know if having the plates facing out is a problem? Seems that all wisby coat I've seen have the leather facing in...

Also, how thick is the leather that you're using? Right now I have in my hand a piece of 5mm think leather that I can hardly bend it...... I am looking for the right leather to make the coat <img src="/forum/images/icons/tongue.gif" alt="" />

Thanks!
Alfred <img src="/forum/images/icons/cool.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forum/images/icons/cool.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forum/images/icons/cool.gif" alt="" />
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Casper Bradak
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Re: Making leather coat for sparring - need advice

Postby Casper Bradak » Mon Apr 04, 2005 10:16 am

I used the armour pattern you linked for a while as well. The metal plates should be facing in. I haven't seen any european armour examples along those lines with the metal visible. If it's done right, lack of a gambeson shouldn't be a big deal in my experience (a sweatshirt will suffice).
The leather should be a compromise of toughness and flexibility. The protective value of the leather isn't a factor with this pattern, it's just a medium for the metal. It needs to be tough enough to hold the rivets rather securely, but it needs to be flexible enough to allow the plates to collapse without you having to exert any force against your armour.
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Alfred Wong
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Re: Making leather coat for sparring - need advice

Postby Alfred Wong » Mon Apr 04, 2005 10:27 am

Thanks Casper! <img src="/forum/images/icons/cool.gif" alt="" />

Alfred
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Robert Subiaga
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Re: Making leather coat for sparring - need advice

Postby Robert Subiaga » Mon Apr 04, 2005 11:36 am

Just an aside, but I've found it extremely easy to make what Oakeshott described as a "pennyplate coat" with large washers, equally available from Home Depot, etc.

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Matthew_Anderson
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Re: Making leather coat for sparring - need advice

Postby Matthew_Anderson » Mon Apr 04, 2005 11:55 am

Yeah, what Casper said! Actually, this type of armour can also be made with heavy fabric like a really thick canvas. Mine is about 5oz. leather that was made for boots so it's pretty tough stuff and is holding up alright. Contact with metal armour and weapons has caused a lot of scratches and scrapes, but no holes or tears yet.
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Casper Bradak
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Re: Making leather coat for sparring - need advice

Postby Casper Bradak » Mon Apr 04, 2005 12:42 pm

True, you can find examples of similar designs even built into the long surcoats from a hundred years before.
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Alfred Wong
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Re: Making leather coat for sparring - need advice

Postby Alfred Wong » Mon Apr 04, 2005 7:45 pm

Thanks all again for the kind responses! <img src="/forum/images/icons/cool.gif" alt="" />

Matt - where did you get your maille? Seems that I can attach them on the coat...
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