Longsword cuts deer like butter

[James_Knowles]

This was a few weeks ago, but I was prompted last night to ensure that a note was posted here, too.

Our study group has a video of Casper cutting a deer carcass clean through with a long sword. As the site says, "This is a great demonstration of the terrific damage a longsword can wreak on an unprotected body."

Brad edited the raw video footage with a twist of whimsy. <img src="/forum/images/icons/crazy.gif" alt="" /> We hope you enjoy it for what it is.

[Randall Pleasant]

Casper

Great video! What type of sword did you use to make the cut.

[Casper Bradak]

It's a del tin dealt by mrl I got when I was a kid, maybe 14 years ago or so. Has the old german steel blade, sword of war variety.

[Casper Bradak]

I should put in some commentary that those not on the e-list can't get.
We only cut with the longsword and the mrl long messer. Brad made several cuts to the body with the longsword, all of which had about the same effect, the least of which still cut through the ribs and the body cavity and impacted on the other side.
My form isn't hot but it certainly didn't seem difficult to cut through the body.
Brad made a few cuts to the waist with the messer, the least of which severed the large muscles and cut through the spine, one of which is on the video.
Brad made several cuts with the messer to the pelvis. It cut through the flesh but refused to penetrate the hip bone. My final strike to the pelvis with the messer put a little finger sized warp in the edge, turned the blade 90 deg in my hand, and the subsequent follow through bent the blade flatwise at the shoulder about 90 deg (but it's been made known that the mrl long messers have false tangs). Trust me, it wasn't due to bad form, it was just a damn hard target on the pelvis.
Brad tried a final cut to the pelvis with the longsword, which severed it.
On a side not, the cuts were noted to be far cleaner and far more effortless than the usual hacksaw method of quartering.
It was also enlightening as to just how extrordinarily messy this type of combat could be. The corpse was drained and gutted, with no live pumping blood or spillable organs, but the blades were still coated with fluids, flesh and fat.

[JeanryChandler]

Man, that was a cool video clip. Liked the sound track too. My first question is, what brands of Longsword and Messer were those? Had you sharpened the longsword before cutting or is that the factory edge? I haven't got a sharp of my own to try out yet, but I was wondering, did you do tons of practice with a blunt first before trying dynamic cuts like that? It seems like the risk of cutting yourself accidentally would be high.

I thought your form was actually pretty good. Your editing etc. was even better! I got to learn to make our sparring clips like that.


Jeanry

P.S. What brand / type sharp longsword replica would you reccomend for somebody with a pretty limited budget?

[Casper Bradak]

Thanks. The longsword was a very old del tin. I personally sharpened it, though being a del tin, isn't really meant to have an edge, but it was pretty sharp.
The messer was mrl. They have a much sharper edge than del tins out of the factory generally, and I also sharpened it. Don't get one though, they currently have false tangs.
It was all edited and put together by Brad, the one cutting with the messer.
As for my form, it was a bit more of a chop than I prefer, and I didn't lead with my weapon quite enough, but the carcass didn't seem to notice.
Since I don't get to cut such excellent targets much, I think I guaged my range first, that's about it. I train with blunts and sharps all the time, it's no different than training techniques or flouryshing with intent, you'll come to know where your blade's going. You need power and speed, but when you have it, it does the work by itself and the flesh and bone put up no noticable resistance, making it really no different than targetless training with intent. The form shouldn't change.
As for my recommendations, I haven't shopped around in quite a while, I'm poor as dirt. I like my mrl's, but most other people don't. I no longer buy swords with flat edges like del tins, with the intent of sharpening them. Too sharp for good blunts and too blunt for good sharps in my opinion.
MRL has a promising looking longsword in their new catalog. Albion is putting out their squire line for about the price of del tins, but I'm sceptical because they refute claims of authenticity in their blades by making them blunt like del tins.

[JeanryChandler]

Thanks for the comment, the only steel longsword I have right now weighs 4 1/2 lbs and has a funny balance, it's hard to get used to cutting with it. I'd like to get a real one more in the 2-3 lbs range, like maybe a semi-sharp if you will.

I heard about the MRL Messer. Mike Cartier had one which broke at the tang. Too bad too because it was real nice to play with / look at. The Cold Steel one looks nice but is also too heavy by at least a pound.

I was looking at this one MRL 'Swiss' longsword, but for this price it's bound do have a weak tang or something...

http://www.ancientedge.com/product_20_detailed.html

Jeanry

[Casper Bradak]

Cutting the hip bone reminded me, I don't know if it's a b.s. story or not, but I remember hearing about a samurai or some such, who had a really big prisoner to practice his cuts on, and him and his buddies were reluctant to try certain cuts, fearing they'd chip their blades on his pelvis. This sheds an understandable light on it, even with substandard replicas.
The pelvis put a significant but repairable warp in the messers edge. Had it been a harder temper, it could very well have chipped out a piece of the edge.

[JeffGentry]

Hey Casper
is the longsword the Del Tin?

that put's thing's in a new light to me is the first video of meat being cut i have seen.

Jeff

[Alfred Wong]

Really nice cutting video... it did freak out some guys around here...

[David Craig]

Very impressive at showing the lethal cutting power of a longsword. Did you guys try any thrusts too?

David

[robrobertson]

I absolutely LOVE that video! Thanks for sharing! <img src="/forum/images/icons/grin.gif" alt="" />

Rob

[JeanryChandler]

Cold Steel puts out a video showing their swords doing a lot of this kind of thing, cutting through sides of beef, barrels of water, phone books, etc. etc.

They'll send it to you for free.

The most impressive thing to me was how well the spear cuts, they used a boars spear to chop up a huge piece of meat in like three cuts... I never before really thought of cutting with a spear.

The interesting thing about this here clip is that it proves the cold steel stuff is probably legit. It doesn't probably take a phenomenally sharp sword to do it, just correct cutting technique and decent edge geometry probably.

Jeanry

[Casper Bradak]

"Del Tin?"
Yes, see earlier posts on this thread.
"Thrusts?"
We didn't do much in the way of thrusts on that one, but they usually put up negligable resistance. Depends on what bones you run into though. You have to push a little if the blade is vertical and going through horizontal ribs and you are using a cutting blade, but with intent that is also negligable. A falchion point would probably get in the way with the ribs too much to penetrate easily or deeply though (yet still lethally).

For sharpness, if it doesn't go to an edge, the geometry is lousy. A dull sword is like a mace without the oomph. You have to find the balance between functionality and durability with the edge, but swords can be quite sharp and retain very good durability. That particular del tin is very sharp, and I've struck helmets with it full force, and the result was a hardly dulled edge. Del tins will naturally have a steeper bevel when sharpened because they're not supposed to be sharp, but I think it goes to show what a sword should be able to take (if anything, due to the del tin geometry, it didn't cut as well as most like originals).
Dull swords simply don't cut well.

[Matt Staats]

That makes me wish I had a good sword for after deer hunting up in the Northwoods!