How do some providers compare with each other?

[Corey Roberts]

How well do Museum Replicas Limited weapons compare with say Albion or other providers. For a while I've been receiving catalogues from MRL but only recently discovered other providers. How do they compare and why is there such a difference in price?

[Allen Johnson]

In the world of swords you get what you pay for. MRL and CASI/ Hanwei line are kind of considered to be the bottom rung in acceptable swords for our type of use. The MRL swords have a sort of semi sharp edge on them with dont exactly make them super sharp but are still probably too sharp to spar with. There is the practical line for CASI/ Hanwei which are very affordable and are still a decent sword that can be used for blunt sparring. Albion, Del Tin and others reflect a higher quality of both make and attention to historical accuracy. For instance: I have the MRL Scottish Basket hilt. Its put together decently and wasnt too expensive. It is however, way too big (in the basket) and way to heavy compared to what is historically accurate. With MRL it seems there shorter swords are fairly decent but they havent really got science of the longer swords down to make it worth the buy. Albion is more expensive because its a much better product. Just like a Porche is going to be a much better car (and higher price) than a Dodge neon. They are both cars, but are not on the same level of quality. So you can go the cheaper route but it will probably be oversized/over weight, less historically accurate and not as solid of a weapon as more expensive brands. Hope this helps- If you are interested in a specific sword please ask. between the lot of us there are very few swords that we collectivley have not handled or used.

[Bill Welch]

But be careful when you get a sword, because historically accurate may not be what you want if you want a sword that will stand up to being used. You may want to talk to the different makers and see how they produce their weapons. Because there is historically accurate, and there is modern historically accurate, as I found out. <img src="/forum/images/icons/tongue.gif" alt="" />

[Sean_Gallaty]

This is a question I wanted to ask also -

I don't need historically accurate for my blunt practice - except in heft, balance and resonance.

Appearance isn't really critical either though it's pleasant if it pleases the eye - what I do need is something blunt steel that is valid to practice with.

[Brian Hunt]

If your looking for in-expensive blunt, look at the paul chen practical hand and a half. It is a pretty good blunt for a really good price. If you want to spend more on a blunt, then I would look at Albions squire line, or for a bit more, their Maestro line. I would also look at Lutel. MRL's swords, while not really sharp, are not a true blunt, they are somewhere between a blunt and a sharp sword. The thing to remember with European swords is that they cut as much by their blade geometry as by the sharpness of their edge, so MRL can be a dangerous sparring weapon.

hope this helps.

Brian Hunt
GFS

[Shane Smith]

Windlass/mrl hilts are creaky and the blades tend to be whippy in my experience. They are reasonably balanced in many cases though and I've seen them survive hard knocks that more prestigious brands have not.

DelTins are good for the price if you get the right models. I have the 5143, the Copenhagen and the "hand and a half". The first two are excellent cutters while the last model is a very tuckish thrusting weapon. All are tough as nails and have survived several hits on maille and plate with no substancial damage to their sharp edges.

My Albion balances nicely but I cannot comment on it's heavy cutting abilities at this time.

Atrims have been more fragile on armoured targets in my own hands than I would like although the XIIIa "heavy" I used to own was a vicious cutter on soft-medium targets.

[Jeffrey Hull]

I like to take a decent Windlass sword and make it an outstanding sword by some hard work of customising.

To take the car analogy a little further, it is sort of like what Shelby did with Mustangs <img src="/forum/images/icons/wink.gif" alt="" />

Seriously, though, Windlass are tough and flexible and can last you a long time. But buying one of those is sort of like getting a *kit*. One must reset the stock-grip with epoxy-resin or make a new hardwood grip set with epoxy-resin (I have done both, for five different swords). The blades are also somewhere in between true sharp and true blunt. If you want sharp, I highly advise you or trusted friend differentially sharpening (I have done so three times -- this is at your own risk), and not MRL sharpening service (really sharp, but not historically accurate). If you want blunt, then you/friend can easily blunt it.

If in between is fine by you, and you plan not to swing it, then do none of that stuff, but realise it would not be ready for tough practice. If you do those things, then you shall have a sword fit for tough practice.

Hopefully that helps.

JH

[Jake_Norwood]

I'll agree but with a caveat. I have yet to see a windlass blade longer than 32" that didn't become uselessly whippy. Shorter, and they do okay. The now discontinued "sword of Albrecht II" had a fantastic blade, IMO.

Jake

[Jeffrey Hull]

Jake, I can assure you that the Windlass longswords I have used in practice cutting are not uselessly whippy. <img src="/forum/images/icons/wink.gif" alt="" />

I have handled an Arms &amp; Armor greatsword that was just as *whippy* as any Windlass.

JH

[Jake_Norwood]

Jeff,

I can assure you that anything that I've handled from Windlass--including during my visit to the factory last year--that is over 30" or so in length on the blade, is very whippy. Their two handed swords and "German War Sword" being amongst the worst.

But again, I love cutting with my Albrecht II, and it's a Windlass (but just at 30" or so)

Jake

[Shane Smith]

My own experiences with Windlass blades leads me to echo Jakes conclusion. Their "Sword of War" is a creaky-hilted, whippy bladed rattletrap in my opinion and I have handled four of this model and I have likewise been unimpressed with any other MRL I have handled save for Tim Sheetz's Arbedo; It seemed a worthy blade to me. Matt Anderson has an old Deltin bladed MRL sharp and pointy that also isn't half bad.

All that said, some of our guys report getting good ones.

[Sean_Gallaty]

If you will pardon the uninitiated question, what is whip in a blade? What causes it and what problems does it pose?

[Stacy Clifford]

Whippiness is generally lack of stiffness. If you shake it in the flat direction and it jiggles too much or deflects too far (subjective criteria, I know), it's whippy. It can effect the way the blade performs "in flight" under hard acceleration and deceleration and upon impact, making handling more difficult and probably unrealistic. Causes are a combination of blade geometry and temper. A real blade should be springy, but still fairly stiff.

[Jake_Norwood]

I'll add to what Stacy wrote. If the flex is down by the hilt, in the "strong" of the blade, you've got issues.

Jake

[George Turner]

I think a common cause of this problem is swords that don't have quite the thickness in the strong as an original, since starting with thicker stock means more overall grinding and higher cost. This thinner forte then gets a big fuller ground into it, which makes the sword lighter but worsens the flex problem.

Off topic. German's are now blamed for the Viking invasion of England. Annanova story

Looks like Olaf and Haggar preferred a Solingen. <img src="/forum/images/icons/grin.gif" alt="" />