Late-12th century Wrestling in knightly combat

European historical unarmed fighting techniques & methods

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John_Clements
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Late-12th century Wrestling in knightly combat

Postby John_Clements » Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:25 pm

I have discovered what is perhaps one of the earliest examples of martial wrestling between knights in single-combat. In the late-12th century Germanic tale of an Arthurian knight, "Erec", by Hartmann von Aue, we are told how “much to his advantage” Erec had “during his youth in England…also learned quite thoroughly the art of wrestling, along with other useful skills” (lines 9270-9295).

The account is unique not only for the accurate description of a throw using counter-leverage to work the opponent’s own strength against him, but in the instinctive follow up that occurs. As his opponent, the red knight, his sword having broken, charges Erec and attempts to grapple, Erec instead throws him to the ground then immediately mounts and pummels him into submission in a fashion entirely familiar to many a streetfight and playground tussle:
“Erec then made a show of his strength. As his opponent bent over, Erec thrust his shoulder before the red knight’s chest, so that the man could not get at him. With great might Erec shoved him away and jerked him back again so swiftly that the huge fellow began to fall. Because of his weight he could not regain his balance, but toppled to the ground instead. At this point the noble Erec pounced upon him. Erec, that performer of amazing feats, inflected upon his opponent every bit as much distress as he himself felt delighted. He knelt upon his chest and pelted him so many times that the knight, as he lay there beneath Erec, grew weary of living. He altogether ceased to offer any defense” (lines 9296-9315).

We are also told how in such wrestling, “It is most difficult to obtain a firm grip on a man wearing armor,” which makes perfect sense given the maile byrnies worn during the time the tale was written.

That's all.

JC
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JeffGentry
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Re: Late-12th century Wrestling in knightly combat

Postby JeffGentry » Thu Feb 03, 2005 11:53 pm

Hey Guy's

He knelt upon his chest and pelted him so many times that the knight, as he lay there beneath Erec, grew weary of living. He altogether ceased to offer any defense


Sound's like some evidence of quite a bit of striking as well as wrestling.

Jeff
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Jay Vail
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Re: Late-12th century Wrestling in knightly combat

Postby Jay Vail » Fri Feb 04, 2005 5:47 am

Fascinating.

Could you share the source for that?

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Jeffrey Hull
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Re: Late-12th century Wrestling in knightly combat

Postby Jeffrey Hull » Fri Feb 04, 2005 1:27 pm

That is interesting.

It reminds me a little bit of the part in "Beowulf" (8th-10th CentAD) where Grendel's Mother and Beowulf are wrestling, and she throws him upon his "axles" (shoulders - flat on his back), straddles his chest, and tries to stab him with her scramasax (?), which his byrnie turns aside.

What you quoted would be the earliest reference to wrestling from the Chivalric Era which I ever read.

JH
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Rachel Miller
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Re: Late-12th century Wrestling in knightly combat

Postby Rachel Miller » Fri Oct 14, 2005 6:14 am

Dear Mr. Clements,

I came across this passage from 'Erec' last year, in the course of research for my doctoral thesis on the depiction of combat in medieval German literature - it is indeed very interesting! I am planning to write an article on this and other instances of wrestling in literature of the time once I have finished writing up my thesis, and hope to publish it in 2006 (probably online, linked to the website of the Linacre School of Defence, of which I am a member).

One thing which I found particularly interesting is the fact that Erec grasps Mabonagrin's belt in order to get purchase for the throw - do you think that this is solely due to the fact that both men are wearing mail, which makes gripping anywhere else difficult? Or could this be taken from a system of wrestling where belt-holds are used?

Thanks!

Rachel Miller
Linacre School of Defence
Oxford
UK

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John_Clements
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Re: Late-12th century Wrestling in knightly combat

Postby John_Clements » Sat Oct 15, 2005 9:48 am

Hi Rachel,
Can't really say, but your hypothesis makes sense to me. They do almost the same with belts worn in judo. I've come across a lot of wrestling in pre-13th century chivalric literature as well, and in 16th century epics too. It will make a great thesis I'm sure. I'll look for ward to it. Good luck.
Say hi to Milo for us.

JC

In the recent popular Shamus translation of Beowulf purposely chooses to grapple and gets Grendel in an arm / shoulder lock specifically becuase the creature is "unskilled in the unarmed fighting arts." <img src="/forum/images/icons/smile.gif" alt="" />
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Jaron Bernstein
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Re: Late-12th century Wrestling in knightly combat

Postby Jaron Bernstein » Sun Oct 16, 2005 12:35 pm

In general, any solid clothing you can get a handle on when wrestling is useful. That makes wrestling with and without some form of grabbable garment (this isn't t-shirt that will just rip away) such vastly different animals.

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JeffGentry
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Re: Late-12th century Wrestling in knightly combat

Postby JeffGentry » Sun Oct 16, 2005 3:04 pm

Hey Folk's

I am a fan of grabbing the waste band's of my opponent's pant's, they seem to hold up well(pun intended) to being grabbed.


Jeff
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