Postby Joachim Nilsson » Wed Dec 28, 2005 12:53 pm
Don't worry, you can still use Talhoffer as a reference.
Whoever it was who made that statement about Talhoffer being a "actor/stage performer is so greatly misinformed it isn't even funny. What did he base his claims on? Thorough researched and diligent practice? Any particular plates he referenced too? I don't know about you but a pommel smashing my face to bits or a dagger to the base of my skull isn't exactly stage fighting...
The techniques in Talhoffers fechtbücher are not for show. First of all they lie well within the Lichtenauer tradition, so if Talhoffer was a stage performer then Lichtenauer must have been that too. Second of all, and this is the crux of the matter itself, this is not the first time I see, or read, about someone making outrageous claims concerning Talhoffer. His fechtbücher are among the more misunderstood and misinterpreted ones out there. Basically claims that the one you encountered, along with claims like "oh, his books are just a collection of tricks" are among the most common ones. And they are, bluntly put; wrong in claiming so. He is for real and his fechtbücher are more than just a collection of tricks. This becomes truly evident once you train and pratice his techniques. Propbably it's the somewhat uncoherent presentation form (a technique here and a technique there) that have lured people into drawing such conclusions. Which is also wrong since a good deal of his plates (especially in the 1467 Ed.) actually belong to each other -most commonly as a single technique followed by either a follow-up technique or a counter to the initial technique. This is even sometimes followed by a counter to the counter.
Simply put: there is a system behind all the techniques he shows. Aside from being totally in line with the Lichtenauer tradition, his system basically boils down to a lying figure "8". That's his movement pattern. And that movent pattern dictates how you perform most of his techniques. Sometimes you go for the full figure "8", while at other times the given technique just "uses" a half or a quarter of the figure. This "paddling" movement pattern (where hand and foot movement are coordinated) is the red herring is his books. Poleaxe, halfswording, dagger, messer -all follow the same pattern.
As for Talhoffer himself (c1420-c1490): He was for quite some time employed as the Master of Arms of the Swabian knight Leutold von Königsegg, whom he also trained for a judicical combat he [von Königsegg] fought, and emerged victorious from, in c1459. As far as we've gathered Talhoffer was still in his employ around c1467. And no "mere" actor could have pulled that off successfully. Especially since his employer von Königsegg was a feudatory to the Count of Wurtemberg who had his own private army who did their fare share of fighting in the once so troublesome Swabia. There is even sources that claim that Talhoffer actually spent some time in jail as a punishment for some fight that broke out and involved is fechtschule students. Which, to me, is another notch in the belt for Talhoffer being something other than an "actor".
As for halfswording not being practical: Others before me have already answered this quite good, and I agree with them.
We have an upcoming multimedia presentation of techniques from Talhoffer's 1467 Ed fechtbuch coming up during Q1 or Q2 of 2006 that you might want to keep an eye open for.
Best,
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ARMA Gimo, Sweden
Semper Fidelis Uplandia
