Question about Talhoffer's terminology

[Kenneth Armstrong]

I've got a question about some terminology that I've seen in "Medieval Combat" originally by Talhoffer. In plate 23, the figure on the left is using a guard that looks like a drooping Ochs and Talhoffer calls it a "weak" guard, whereas the figure on the right is considered using a "strong" guard. What distinguishes the two?

[JeffGentry]

I've got a question about some terminology that I've seen in "Medieval Combat" originally by Talhoffer. In plate 23, the figure on the left is using a guard that looks like a drooping Ochs and Talhoffer calls it a "weak" guard, whereas the figure on the right is considered using a "strong" guard. What distinguishes the two?

Hey Kenneth

The swordsman on the left is in a weak gaurd because of the way the hand's are crossed out in front, add to that the fact the point is down, it is very easy for the swordsman on the right to come right through by pushing down and forward.

When ever your sword is out front and your hand's are crossed it is an inherently weak postion by virtue of the crossed up hand's, I like to see guy's do this in sparring and such because it is so easy to tie them up and come right on through and there is no real threat from there sword.

Jeff

[Kenneth Armstrong]

I've got a question about some terminology that I've seen in "Medieval Combat" originally by Talhoffer. In plate 23, the figure on the left is using a guard that looks like a drooping Ochs and Talhoffer calls it a "weak" guard, whereas the figure on the right is considered using a "strong" guard. What distinguishes the two?

Hey Kenneth

The swordsman on the left is in a weak gaurd because of the way the hand's are crossed out in front, add to that the fact the point is down, it is very easy for the swordsman on the right to come right through by pushing down and forward.

When ever your sword is out front and your hand's are crossed it is an inherently weak postion by virtue of the crossed up hand's, I like to see guy's do this in sparring and such because it is so easy to tie them up and come right on through and there is no real threat from there sword.

Jeff

Thanks, that's what I was wondering. The guy on the right didn't have his arms crossed, so that's wha I figured.

I was wondering what would work to come out of it, such as side cuts (going from left to right if your arms are in the same position as that of the plate seemed to work a little better) but you're still pretty much open even if you jumped into this guard to set aside a side cut from the opponent.