My questions regarding defensive manoeuvres

[JeffGentry]

Mike

Without being there It is more than difficult to give advice on a specific situation, You could traverse and zornhau him, you could step into the strike and set it aside from the direction it came and thrust, you could bind and wind to the opposite side then release the bind and come over the top to his head.

These do require a certain skill set to accomplish the best thing would be to not be competitive and do some specific drill's, such as what is above and as you get more prficient speed them up, then once you are comfortable start to experiment with other thing's, there are a number of video's in the member area I would recommend looking at those if you are an ARMA member.

Or look at the video's here to get an idea of option's available to you, distance and timing are crucial to fencing I think these will determine more than anything what you can or should do.

http://www.thearma.org/Videos/TPVideos.htm

Jeff

[Michael Navas]

Thanks, guys. This should give me something to test both mind and body against for some time to come. I'm also not an ARMA member, so I'll have to read up on the terminology.

You can counter cut. This is a versetsen. Strike with a right zornhau (diagonal strike) at him so that your sword meets and stops his at your strong and hits his head/shoulders or arms, depending on range, with your weak.

Glad you brought this up. It is exactly the sort of parry I don't understand. How is it possible to counterattack in this way without nicking the edges against each other? I don't see how you can strike diagonally at an incoming attack like this and not go edge on edge, at least a little. Am I supposed to angle the blade before impact so as to avoid any edge contact, and if so, wouldn't that ruin its offensive potential?

Otherwise, my fingers are itching to try these suggestions. Thanks.

[Greg Coffman]

Okay, lets talk about the guard "long point." I will use Meyer to illustrate.
http://www.schielhau.org/Meyer.p3.html
The main figure on the right is in long point. You stand with the sword stretched out towards the other guy. This is basically the position that you are in at the furthest point of a thrust. This is also the position you should be in during many strikes such as an overhand. You friend will be in this position, or near to it, about the time he hits you during his horizontal strike.

Image that he has swung at you and stopped at long point. His sword will be pointed at you and his edges will be about parallel to the ground. Now, if you strike directly down and end at this same position, you will also have your sword pointed right at him but with your edges perpendicular to the ground. Your sword lands on top of his flat. Your blade should lay along his blade. Does this make sense?

You can do this even by striking at a diagonal instead of directly down. This is what we are advising to do with a zornhau. Once you see it demonstrated in person and get the feel for it then it makes a lot of sense and works very well.

[Michael Navas]

Image that he has swung at you and stopped at long point. His sword will be pointed at you and his edges will be about parallel to the ground. Now, if you strike directly down and end at this same position, you will also have your sword pointed right at him but with your edges perpendicular to the ground. Your sword lands on top of his flat. Your blade should lay along his blade. Does this make sense?

Ah. So you are basically smacking his blade down while cutting at him. I thought you were supposed to obstruct it in mid-strike, while cutting. That makes more sense now.

But isn't that dreadfully hard to do? Hitting directly on top of a blade in motion? But I suppose this zornhau is a good deal easier than a vertical parry would have been in this regard. And as a matter of fact, he does stop in mid-strike, tip pointed at me, so that should further help things.

Okay. Thanks again.

[philippewillaume]

Hello
As jeff said without seeing it is difficult to say but in any case if he strike at you with extend arms and that you can step back, then you can equally step to the right and to the left.
As you do it either strike a krump or a shiel to his hands.
That is the second narchraisen

You can move forward.
In that case if you got him early in his move (and he strike relatively straight) you can do a swerch (and remember a Zwerch explicitly require a step to the side).
If you get him rather late, strike a sheil to his throat (he will be in long point). That is stiking according to the second narch raisen.
If you get him somewhat in the middles a zorn is a safe bet.
Or you can do all the pieces from the straichen.

All of that will be what ringeck call an absetsen or what Vd call a good vesetzen.

Basically if he strikes with extended arms and you can go back he is striking from too far away and he is not really in the vor. So I would let him extend as much I can or at least not act before his shoulder pass his hips (it is much more difficult for him to change after that ) and either go for a cut at the hands or a shiel at the throat.

Any of those strikes is a cut in his cut, it will not block ever, and they are just redirection of his movement. So he has to stop his blade and bring it back. There is not point of making life easier for him
phil

[Greg Coffman]

But isn't that dreadfully hard to do? Hitting directly on top of a blade in motion?

It really isn't. You cut in such a way that you place your blade in the path of his blade. You don't have to time it just right, although starting with drills at slower speeds and working up to full speed will certainly help build your sense of timing. You can step off line to your right to give you a little bit more time. But this is about placement. Place your blade in the way of his strike but also so that you hit him.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3DhjFUOG6Y
In this video you can see about the same thing as I am talking about. In the fourth exchange, the fighter on the left cuts a right zornhau as does the fighter on the left. In this case, neither hits and both are positioned for a thrust. That is how this should look except in your case with your partner throwing a a horizontal strike. You should alse be able to get your strike to land expecially with a right step off line.

But if you don't hit go for the thrust. You should be able to gain the initiative. If you can't immediately get the thrust to work, or if he goes for the thrust as well, then wind up into left ochs as shown in the fifth exchange in the video.

Is this starting to make sense yet?

[LafayetteCCurtis]

But isn't that dreadfully hard to do? Hitting directly on top of a blade in motion? But I suppose this zornhau is a good deal easier than a vertical parry would have been in this regard.

It's very hard to do if you only move your hands. If you move your body and feet too, it'll be as natural as breathing. I don't think I've ever managed to do a succesful zornhau without stepping aside at the same time, so I'm accustomed to thinking that it simply won't work without swift and well-directed footwork. Even a static block in hengen wouldn't work without a little evasive footwork. But I might be wrong.

One thing I do when the horizontal blow comes in stronger than I thought is adding an additional evasive step in the middle of the zornhau. Ordinarily I'd just step forward and away from the opponent; but in this situation, I'd pull the back foot (the one that becomes the back foot after the first step, that is) backwards along a circle centered on my leading foot. Of course I'd still be continuing the zornhau along the line I've established before.

Sometimes, when the blow really comes without warning, I'd resort to a panic tactic; thrust into the blow and let it graze (obliquely!) along the edge of my blade until the cross stops it. I'd try to angle the thrust so it still strikes the opponent, but usually I'm too brain-dead to do this properly so it ends up with both swords out of line. From there I'd treat it like a bind and use grappling movements. I don't think this is a very good way of handling the situation, though. Remember that I said it's a panic reaction.