How to grip the blade while half-swording?

[Rob Schneider]

Eric Allen and I were trying to figure out how to grip the blade safely while half-swording, ad we couldn't come up with a definitive answer. The closest we came was Eric's suggestion that we grip the blade by pinching it between the fingertips and the palm, without using the thumb. However, Tallhoffer shows the sword being gripped like a stave (plates 26, 28 and 33 are good examples). When I tried this, however, I put little cuts into the gloves I was wearing, which would have bleed had they been in bare skin.

So, for those of you who have done it without losing fingers, how do you grip the blade safely?

[Shane Smith]

I grip it tightly between my palm and my fingers. I've never been cut doing so. In armour with gauntlets, I'm a bit more random to no ill effect.

http://www.thearma.org/essays/armoredlongsword.html

[Dave Neeson]

I always thought that the riccaso section of the blade for gripping was ment to be left blunt???

[Dave Neeson]

I always thought that the riccaso section of the blade for gripping was ment to be left blunt???

[Dave Neeson]

I always thought that the riccaso section of the blade for gripping was ment to be left blunt???

[LafayetteCCurtis]

The ricasso was left blunt, but half-swording often involved gripping the sword near the middle of the blade--where it was usually sharpened to some extent.

[Dave Neeson]

ohhh ok and sorry bout the 3 posts guys no idea how that happened

[Dave Neeson]

ohhh ok and sorry bout the 3 posts guys no idea how that happened

[Will Adamson]

How sharp was a longsword that might be used against plate has to be considered as well. I've seen the contention that modern replica swords are sharpened much finer than historic ones. A sword doesn't have to be razor sharp to hack off a limb. See the bamboo and blunt sword video on the ARMA website.

I'm of the opinion that most folks of earlier, less comfortable times were just plain tougher than we are. Even now, a farmer or factory worker is going to be able to grip a blade with much more confidence than an office worker.

[jeremy pace]

Well, we have found the best method is holding the actual edge in a joint and not applying much force there. Halfsword is really like using the sword as a shield. Since you are applying the force of the blow to the flat (in the worst kind of parry if you cant deflect the force) the flat should be on your palm and not injure your hand much at all. Add leather gloves and it is much safer even if the blade slips a little...

My biggest concern is when halfswording the opponent binds and his edge slides down or up onto exposed fingers!

[Ken McKenzie]

There was an interesting discussion relevant to this subject on myarmory a while ago.

Here's the link:

http://www.myarmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=2942

[philippewillaume]

Hello it depends, Ringeck is using half sword almost only in his armoured section.
We have example when it is use un-armoured. The one time ringeck is using it if is after delivered a strike on one side and it hgas been paried we zwerch back and then half sword as we thrust him.
If that fails we strike him the other side of the blade with the pommel. (Used in thus conditions it makes it relatively safe against getting you finger chopped of by the opposition.
That being said talhoffer and codex walenstein or fiore seem to be more keen to use it when un-armoured.)

Yet an other piece against the parry (set aside)
Set at the four ends (as in opening), stay hereon. You will teach to end.
Glose
When you strike an oberhaw from your right shoulder, would you then boldly/directly ending it with him, so note, when he set aside so strike then boldly/directly around with a swerch. And grab your sword with left hand in the middle of the blade, and place him the point to the face. Or set it at the one of the four opening that you can reach the best.

(36 v) Aber ain stuck wider die versatzung.
Item, wan dü jm mit dem halben schwert den ort jn sin gesicht setzest, versetzt er dir das, so stoß jn mit dem knopff zu° der an deren sytten zu° sienem haupt. Oder spring mit dem recht fuosß hinder sin lincken, vnd far jm mit dem knopff vber sin rechten achseln vornen vmb den halß vnd ruck jn da mit vber din rechtes bain.

Yet another piece against the parry (set aside)
Item, when you set the point of the half-sword to his face, set it he aside, then drive/strike with the pommel to the other side at his head. Or jump with the right foot behind his left and drive your pommel over his right shoulder in front of the neck and press/move him then over your right leg.

As it is been said before From what I have tried it is relatively safe to hold the blade in you hand provide that you grab it in the middle of the blade and the blade has an edge it geometry is that is not as sharp as the edge of the last foot/hand.
With blades that are relatively flat, I think it is safer to use a glove, just on case.
For diamond section blade, it is fine without gloves.

In the 1459 (Thot edition) it seems that there was special blades, designed to fight in harness. Buy the late 13th century blades were much more of a commodity so there may have been a more task/style oriented approach.

phil