Sword in Two Hands by Brian R. Price

[Kirksey_Dave]

Greetings,

A friend of mine and I have recently begun our WMA studies, and as a terrible spendthrift I am always on the look out for a new book. Between the two of us we have probably six or so. In my browsing I have recently found Chivalry Bookshelf. One such book is a Fiore translation entitled 'Sword in Two Hands'. Apparently it is a translation of 'Fior di Battaglia' with the authors own input, etc. I was wondering if anyone out there has picked this up and if I should consider it. There are some items and the description that caught my attention but before I spent $50 on a book I thought I would seek some input.

Thanks for your time,
Dave Kirksey
ARMA hopeful

[Sean Barrows]

I was a member of Schola St. George in California for about a year, this is the school the author started. The book is by no means a step by step how-to manual on the Fiore system, but as I am sure you are realizing, none of the books on this subject really are. That being said, my practice partner and I often refer to it for clarification. The book has several typos, but is beautifully illustrated. However, I am currently leaning more towards Liechtenauer in my studies, hence my interest in ARMA.

Sean Barrows
Also an ARMA hopeful

Greetings,

A friend of mine and I have recently begun our WMA studies, and as a terrible spendthrift I am always on the look out for a new book. Between the two of us we have probably six or so. In my browsing I have recently found Chivalry Bookshelf. One such book is a Fiore translation entitled 'Sword in Two Hands'. Apparently it is a translation of 'Fior di Battaglia' with the authors own input, etc. I was wondering if anyone out there has picked this up and if I should consider it. There are some items and the description that caught my attention but before I spent $50 on a book I thought I would seek some input.

Thanks for your time,
Dave Kirksey
ARMA hopeful

[Jaron Bernstein]

I was a member of Schola St. George in California for about a year, this is the school the author started. The book is by no means a step by step how-to manual on the Fiore system, but as I am sure you are realizing, none of the books on this subject really are. That being said, my practice partner and I often refer to it for clarification. The book has several typos, but is beautifully illustrated. However, I am currently leaning more towards Liechtenauer in my studies, hence my interest in ARMA.

Sean Barrows
Also an ARMA hopeful

Greetings,

A friend of mine and I have recently begun our WMA studies, and as a terrible spendthrift I am always on the look out for a new book. Between the two of us we have probably six or so. In my browsing I have recently found Chivalry Bookshelf. One such book is a Fiore translation entitled 'Sword in Two Hands'. Apparently it is a translation of 'Fior di Battaglia' with the authors own input, etc. I was wondering if anyone out there has picked this up and if I should consider it. There are some items and the description that caught my attention but before I spent $50 on a book I thought I would seek some input.

Thanks for your time,
Dave Kirksey
ARMA hopeful

ARMA does study Fiore and other Italian masters. We take a holistic approach rather than focusing on a particular master or tradition. Our local study group has spent the last 6 months slowly picking our way through Fiore. Regarding Sword In Two Hands, I would instead suggest that you go directly to the source and read Fiore yourself. There are some free online translations available I can link to in you need them.

[Jonathan Newhall]

Yar, ARMA itself recommends any method that grants a scholarly approach to the art as a whole (reading a manual one at a time, reading a compilation work, an interpretation with non-denoministic movesets and names, et c.)

[Randall Pleasant]

The book has several typos, but is beautifully illustrated.

Personally I find that the book to be too pretty. I have a hard time reading the book because it is so over illustrated. For those same reasons I could never read magazines such as Wire. But if you can read stuff with layouts similar to Wire then it should be no problem.

[nathan featherstone]

hi i wanted to ask peoples advice is there anywhere i could get my hands on paulus hector mair's work i know theres the polearm book but i want to see the rest of his work is there anywhere i can go to do that or any book i could buy???

[Jaron Bernstein]

hi i wanted to ask peoples advice is there anywhere i could get my hands on paulus hector mair's work i know theres the polearm book but i want to see the rest of his work is there anywhere i can go to do that or any book i could buy???

The original is available on line, but not in translation. If you like I can provide a link. There are a few portions of the dagger section translated.

[nathan featherstone]

yes please do i would love to get a good look at it thank you

[Jaron Bernstein]

yes please do i would love to get a good look at it thank you

Here ya go:

http://mdz10.bib-bvb.de/~db/bsb00006570/images/

http://mdz10.bib-bvb.de/~db/bsb00001648/images/

enjoy!

[nathan featherstone]

thank you. em i wanted to ask one question there is a black guy fighting in one of the plates is that not slightly unusual for the period any idea who he was or how he got to train there?
maybe im just not informed well enough anyone who can enlighten me to this?

[Sal Bertucci]

That has always been one of the interesting things that I noted as well, but it's not too hard to explain. (many ASSUMPTIONS coming) I'm thinking that more than likely he's the servant of someone who was big into the AoD at the time. Probably started out as the closest sparring partner, and ended up showing real talent. If I remember what I read of Mair's qualifications for his book, then the individual needed to be highly skilled to pose for the art work.

[Jaron Bernstein]

thank you. em i wanted to ask one question there is a black guy fighting in one of the plates is that not slightly unusual for the period any idea who he was or how he got to train there?
maybe im just not informed well enough anyone who can enlighten me to this?

Nothing definite. I have heard speculation that he could be a visiting diplomat, a visiting noble or just an immigrant fighter. I can't say if any of these are correct though.

[Aaron Pynenberg]

I must say, any book on our subject is more or less welcome, so when I add this little "BUT..." it is with a sincere apprecaition of the effort that went into making it.- that's my blanket statement about any of the books on our craft. BUT....

I find that book to represent everything that is wrong with the manner in which many of the other groups are approaching our craft.

It's no secret, I am not crazy about period type dress...I think it is not needed nor desired for representing the skills of what these fighters were about. They- during the times, dressed that way, but the skills represented in our craft are TIMELESS, Appropriate and relevant to our current, modern predicament.

I do wish I was alive during those days, there is a special relationship I have in my heart to that era, however when we (as a whole community) are attempting to reestablish these skills as skills to be respected and understood, and we represent wearing all the associated clothing, I find that the message of the skills is clouded and confused with role-playing swashbuckling adventures of SCA-type attitudes.

I think ARMA gets it right in this regard and when we train and practice we are wearing simple t-shirts and pants..(or shorts). Our ARMA formal uniform is the exception and we wear a "swordsmans shirt" for formal presentations and such.

I will admitt that I am not even that crazy about these formal outfits, but they have grown on me, but I still make it a point in my lectures to explain the outfit and why we wear it.

Anyway, in the book we see lots of outfits, lots of pictures, lots of guys who are a bit wider in the midriff, and the Author -(with his tongue out) showing stances etc..they look of-ballance, out of shape, and I have to say it --a bit silly.

Folks, this craft has seen enough of that type of representation, I think as a whole the entire community needs to be represented at martial arts expos, and presentations, and less at renn-fair type activities.

Not because I hate those other activities, or think the people doing those things are lazy, or dumb, or whatever...in fact I think it's cool they do thier own thing and in such a way that is legal, safe and fun...

I mean the craft itself, the skills shown to have existed and practiced, have such practical application to all types of fighting, and self-defense...all types of people should be attracted to these skillsets and not just the ones who apprecaite the time period.- AP

[Jonathan Newhall]

I must say, any book on our subject is more or less welcome, so when I add this little "BUT..." it is with a sincere apprecaition of the effort that went into making it.- that's my blanket statement about any of the books on our craft. BUT....

I find that book to represent everything that is wrong with the manner in which many of the other groups are approaching our craft.

It's no secret, I am not crazy about period type dress...I think it is not needed nor desired for representing the skills of what these fighters were about. They- during the times, dressed that way, but the skills represented in our craft are TIMELESS, Appropriate and relevant to our current, modern predicament.

I do wish I was alive during those days, there is a special relationship I have in my heart to that era, however when we (as a whole community) are attempting to reestablish these skills as skills to be respected and understood, and we represent wearing all the associated clothing, I find that the message of the skills is clouded and confused with role-playing swashbuckling adventures of SCA-type attitudes.

This is a minor point of contention I both agree and disagree with. While on the one hand there is the fact that it is easy to confuse realistic point-for-point interpretation (no pun intended) with mere "playing at swords" in the modern sense, there is also the fact that period clothing did factor into several of the techniques. It is a lot easier, for example, to utilize proper footwork in the period shoes without thick soles comprised of rubber gripping material and foam.

On the other hand, aside from utilizing the clothing to enhance the skill and understanding of the student, I do agree that there is a bit of a problem with overdoing it on the garb and underdoing it on the sword.

[Randall Pleasant]

...there is also the fact that period clothing did factor into several of the techniques. It is a lot easier, for example, to utilize proper footwork in the period shoes without thick soles comprised of rubber gripping material and foam.

Jonathan

I must take issue with your statement. Rather than some "fact", you are really saying that period clothing is a factor in some people's interpretations of some techniques. But how much faith should we give their interpretations if it requires us to be dressed in a certain manner? If an interpretation is truely historically valid and martially sound it should be independant from any clothing. Over gripping of some modern shoes is only an issue on modern gym floors, not on dirt or grass. Plus, period shoes on modern gym floors result in lots of sliding. Sliding up to your adversary is just not martially sound!

In regard to looks there is just no way that you can make the following cloths look professional. Is it period? Close enough. Does it look professional? Absolutely not, it looks like a big diaper. It's ok for the renn fair but not in a professional book. And in several pictures in Brian's book it does look like the person is wearing a diaper.