RMA for MMA

[Joshua Cook]

Well, the general consensus that I am seeing here is that ringen would be useful in the ring, with some mild alterations, such as applying gradual pressure in a joint-lock, and changing some strikes to targets allowed by the rules.

Here's how I think I should proceed. Taking Jeff's advice, I will train in a local MMA gym to get used to what is allowed in my local bouts. But I will incorporate ringen in my training and use those techniques where I can.

Opinions? Advice?

[nathan featherstone]

might be useful to train with a coach and get them to see what ringen u do is mma legal so that way u can slowly mix the two into an effective system with firm roots in ringen

[Gable Bates]

I agree with Jeff's assessment--there is overlap in terms of technique and body mechanics, but the goals are different, such as whether or not one is trying to kill the opponent. The differences show up in other ways, too. For example, one of the techniques we've practiced from Codex Wallerstein is a throw that, instead of breaking a limb or dropping the head on the ground, simply puts the opponent on the ground while facing away from you, with some distance in between. On the battlefield with multiple opponents, that can be a lifesaver, but in an MMA competition where a submission hold or KO is the goal, it's more like a waste of time and effort.

Where Ringen can be useful in MMA is learning all the various ways of throwing opponents efficiently, as well as binding the arms and body in ways that prevent counterpunching. If you can close and takedown more effectively without getting hit much or at all, then you'll have more options for ultimately applying submission holds.

[Steven Ott]

When you talk about the "rougher" techniques of any martial art, you must realize that you cannot practice those techniques at full speed against a resisting oponent, and therefore to a large degree you are untrained. The elbow break strike was brought up as an example of this. Who here has really done it? I would guess no one. And if you think about it, that technique requires precise timing and placement of the strike to work. Unless you're fighting a fool who doesnt know to return his strike and just leaves his arm out there. Training in techniques that you can practice against a well-trained resisting opponent gives you the feel you need to fight properly. I wrestled in school and have done submission tournaments. I have seen demonstrations of Ringen techniques on youtube. (As have most of us) And it is really easy to discern who has been trained in wrestling or judo or juijitsu and gone full speed and who hasnt.

Instead of thinking of MMA as lower than Ringen, think of it as full-contact training. The lethal stuff are definetly part of ringen. But it's the part that most likely, none of us will use. And if the case arises where you need it, will you have the timing, the feel and the know-how to use them if you haven't trained full contact?

[Sripol Asanasavest]

there are ways to improve you reflexes the way boxers and Muay Thai boxers do. If you want to be able to use the lethal techniques of Ringen, I guess, you could try to improve your reflexes the way boxers do. And boxers and Muay Thai do practices striking against a moving sand bags, and other equipments. These sandbags weigh 200 lbs. It will sprain your wrist if you don't know how to punch. and boxers practice by boxing one another. they really punch each other. If you are going to practice MA, Ringen or otherwise, you can't be afraid of pain or punching someone. Otherwise, what is the point?

But you're right! Nothing beats first hand experience!