blade destruction tests, and tang width?

[Ryan Ricks]

for those of you who have tried the sword destruction tests, how did they break? do they break at the point of percussion? do they just chip a little? do they snap off at the hilt?

and if so, how wide were the tangs?

none of the (potentially expensive) replica swords i've seen in real life or on the net appear to have tangs as wide as the swords in Oakeshot's book Records of the Medieval Sword. all of those appear to have tangs which might be the full width of the handle.

Ryan

[Casper Bradak]

Among other things, I've seen a few Del Tin tangs bend in the middle and at the shoulder, one of which was forcefully practicing parries, not even a destruction test. None of them had tangs as wide as most originals appear to have been though. Good luck finding one that is.

[Ryan Ricks]

well that being said, i'm gonna stick with museum replicas. i have three of their swords, they cut beautifully (when sharpened) and they are a delight to practice with.

museum replicas stuff seems pretty inexpensive compared to some. based on what you said, the increase in price for other replica swords doesn't lead to an equal increase in quality.

of course, if someone thinks i'm dead wrong, please tell me.

ryan

[GaryGrzybek]

MRL has some decent stuff but I find many of the blades are too wippy for my taste. One of my study partners has their early renaissanse longsword and it performs like a wet noodle. There seems to be an improvement on their tang construction and the weights are pretty darn accurate. I bought an old MRL side sword from someone with a complex hilt and the blade is really stiff, so I guess it's hit or miss depending on the blade geometry.

It seems that most blade failures happen at the tang/blade juncture since there is a lot of stresses in that area. Many sword makers still haven't got it right.

[Shane Smith]

I likewise have found MRL longswords to be too whippy in my hands for the most part <img src="/forum/images/icons/frown.gif" alt="" />

[Shane Smith]

The swords I have seen broken here locally tended to fail at the COP.

[Jeffrey Hull]

Gee whiz...I would say that I have not worked with any "whippy" MRL-Windlass stuff. I own three and have handled six others. In fact, the only "whippy" MRL-thing I handled was no more so than a bigger (and quite excellent) piece by A&amp;A, each blade having a similar cross-section. Well, just how I see it. Of those, I witnessed only the usual wooden-grip-failures (please do not ask me to recount here), and just once an MRL-Windlass sword take a slight set (corrected later) from some harsh treatment and/or misstriking (which I have done before) in cutting practice. That same one, after correcting, is still utilised by its owner for frequent cutting-practice. JH

[John_Clements]

Hi guys,
Quick comments, wide cutting blades with flat cross sections can be and often were surprisingly flexible, some real 14th &amp; 15th specimens I've played with even drooped a bit. When they are not thick they can cut ferociously. Other much thicker blades are of course much stiffer. It can all depend on design.

Re blade failures, I've had them break at all portions except at the ricasso, so far. Interestingly, I notice in historical art though, this is where they are often shown as broken.

JC

[GaryGrzybek]

Hi John,

I certainly agree that a thin flat blade cuts very well and flexibility is importaint but what bothers me is trying to keep the edge in line during a cut. If the blade flexes so far out of line during a circular cut will it be a problem in performance? Is there some ajustment we must make in our technique to compensate for these characteristics?

Just wondering...

[John_Clements]

I should add, the location of such resilient flex on a thin, wide, cutting blade is certainly very important. It needs to be near the last quarter, certainly not the middle of ricasso, as that would make it a unusual whippy blade. As for edge alignment, well, practice aiming is really all we can do.

[Webmaster]

In our destruction test here in Houston a few weeks ago we broke two swords. The first was an Angelsword single hander, which snapped at the shoulder right at the base of the tang. I've seen two other Angelswords break the exact same way, although their blades are very durable. This was done while making some rather deep cuts in a 2x4.

The other was, I believe, a Del Tin longsword hit against the now infamous cinder block in our "castle wall" simulation. The tang was severely bent sideways, and the last 6-8 inches of the blade actually wrapped around the brick and snapped in the middle. We determined this because there was edge damage on both corners of the brick and none in the middle. It was a very violent impact which no blade should be reasonably expected to survive, but the tang should have performed better.

For edge failures that did not result in the blade actually breaking, look up the thread from last year on the Angus Trim swords tested at the International Event. There's pages of discussion on proper edge geometry there.